The Golden Bachelorette ’s Pascal Gets Shockingly Honest About Chock, Hurting Joan’s Feelings, and More

Gilles Mingasson/Disney

The Golden Bachelorette’s Pascal—the Frenchman with a passion for designer clothes, private jets, and coiffed hair—made a name for himself as soon as he walked into the mansion. Whether it was his inability to do his own laundry or his expectations that the Bachelor mansion came with butlers and maids, he was certainly one of the most interesting men the show had ever seen.

But in due time, the 69-year-old salon owner from Chicago won over viewers with his genuine connection with the other men in the house (who could forget his bond with Mark?) and the sobering story of how he came from nothing as a young boy in Paris and built a massively successful salon business in America. Sure, he might talk about himself in the third person a little too much and have trouble going all in on a relationship, but if the point of The Golden Bachelorette is to help get contestants to become more vulnerable and in touch with their feelings (okay, and find love), then mission accomplished.

Still, in the end it was too little too late (or maybe Chock is just too damn far ahead for anyone else to truly capture Joan’s heart), as Pascal got spooked by a traditional Tahitian bonding experience and realized he couldn’t move forward with the 61-year-old private school administrator. While it was commendable of Pascal to be upfront and let Joan know right away, the fallout was heartbreaking. Joan revealed her walls were now going back up—have we ever heard so much talk about walls in one episode?—and she didn’t feel as worthy of being loved.

Time will tell (actually, we’ll know in two weeks when The Golden Bachelorette finale airs) whether Joan will be able to dust herself off and get back on the ceremonial horse; for now, we sat down with Pascal following the taping of the Men Tell All episode to find out what we didn’t see on camera and what he really thinks about Chock. He doesn’t hold back.

Glamour: How difficult was it to watch tonight’s episode?

Pascal: It was hard to see it. It was hard to see it because there is no good way to end a relationship. There is no word you could use to make her feel better. I wasn’t [able to get] there [with Joan]. I tried to get there. I needed more time. My wall was going down, and then she took me to a ceremony and I freaked out. I felt trapped, and I got scared.

It was very hard for me because I know she had feelings for me. I know she cared very much about me. [Going into the] show, I didn’t want to drill on my divorce, I wanted to live the moment. She heard about those widowers with a lot of struggle, a lot of pain they having. And I come on board where my divorce was easy, my life is wonderful, and I just wanted to enjoy the time with her. That’s what she’s probably liked about me.

I was glad you were honest with Joan, but do you wish you had said anything differently as you were preparing to say goodbye?

I said it in a very nice and polite way. I told her, “Look, Joan, I’m not where I need to be for you. It’s hard for me to continue that journey and go any farther with you.” The producer [explained I should be clearer that I wasn’t in love with her], but I was [hesitant] to use that word.

When I saw the show, I saw she was hurt by that because she said [to the cameras], “I’m maybe not worthy to be loved.” That was not my intention. My intention was to tell her that I’m not where she need me to be, and I don’t think if I could get there. I’m sorry if I misled her or misinterpret myself, but I told her from the beginning that I was guarded and it was going to take me time to bring down my wall.

That’s why I told the camera to get away from me. I was very angry. I know the words not in love is very hurtful. I would rather try to be very diplomatic. Unfortunately, she got hurt. I got hurt because emotionally that was very difficult for me, too.

You could tell. How nervous were you going into the Men Tell All taping and seeing her for the first time in months?

I was very happy to see Joan, and I was able to put closure into where we started by telling her that I didn’t mean to hurt her and I’m sorry if it come across that way. I was able to tell her I didn’t want to stay because I know that the [other men were] so, so much in love with her. I didn’t want her to miss that opportunity to be loved, so that’s why I decided to walk away.

A lot of people think Chock is the front-runner, myself included, but I know he kind of rubbed some people the wrong way during your group bowling date.

Oh my God, let’s just be realistic. We are mature men. We’ve been through some marriage, some divorce. We had our struggles and our pain and anxiety, and it’s not that easy to say “I’m in love.” Chock was all over her to the point where he was [like a] stalker. I mean, it was like, “I love you, let’s leave. Let’s do this, let’s do that.” And, “Which side of the bed are you sleeping on?” It’s bizarre behavior. I don’t know. “I can’t wait to be with you. I feel my love with you.” Maybe in Wichita there is no women. I don’t know.

I did not like when he said, “What side of the bed do you sleep on?” I thought that was uncalled for in front of everyone, even if it was meant to be between them.

Inappropriate. As he walked in he said, “Let’s leave here. Let’s get out of here.” And then hovering over her during the bowling. I think, to me, everybody felt uncomfortable. I think Jordan said, “Hey, put the break on,” and Jonathan said, “What are you doing?”

I mean, Joan is smart enough to understand and figure it out by herself.

If she ends up single at the end of this, would you consider seeing if she wanted to rekindle things?

I said from the beginning, if you take a 25- to 30-year-old kid who doesn’t have a pot to pee on, doesn’t own a car, who are in between jobs, who rent an apartment, who’s looking for an identity…it’s easy to say, “Hey, I’m going to move to LA, I’m going to move to New Orleans, and we’re going to make a living together.” But when you are like me, established, I have a business, I have real estate, I have my friends, I have my routine, I have my health club, I have my connection…I ain’t going to move anywhere. They should do The Golden Bachelor of Chicago, The Golden Bachelor of New York, The Golden Bachelor of LA, The Golden Bachelor of Miami.

Chicago’s got 13 million people. You tell me you can’t find 25 widowed or divorced people in that age group? Because in my age, I want to wake up with somebody, I want go to bed with somebody. I want to take a walk with somebody. I don’t want to get in a plane to go see somebody every two weeks. So, I think the concept that The Golden Bachelor needs to be modified to a way where they could accommodate the older generation like myself. To me, if I meet somebody who lives in [another suburb of Chicago], okay then. We could go spend every weekend together. We could spend couple nights a week together. But if you live in Washington DC, when am I going to see you? And I think, to me, that’s the biggest challenge I had with Joan. I didn’t want to invest because I want a partner on a daily basis.

After Gerry and Theresa broke up, I was saying the same thing: There needs to be central locations for this show, because nobody will want to move. But as we have to wrap up, I spoke with Charles L. the other week, and he joked he wants to travel with you all to China as your tour guide and you can pay for it.

I’ve been to Shanghai, I’ve been to Beijing, I’ve been to Xian, been to Guangzhou. I travel basically all over the world, and China is not really my favorite. If you want to travel, take me to Thailand, take me to Laos, Cambodia, Vietnam, India. Those countries [seem] so much more exciting.

But everybody look at me and said, “Oh, you know Pascal is the rich guy.” I don’t want to be portrayed that way. Pascal work his ass off to be where he’s at. Pascal didn’t come from a golden spoon. Pascal come from the ghetto of Paris. Pascal works 14, 16 hours a day to be successful. And for me, they said time is money and money is time. My time is worth in money. With my money I could buy time, I could buy the housekeeper, I could go for dining. I could do a different thing. I think, to me, be in my salon, I make more money than doing my laundry. So I think everybody’s got their own priorities. My priority was my business. I worked for many years to be where I’m at.

You should never have to apologize for it because…

I know, but I just don’t want to be portrayed that golden spoon kind of guy who fly private jet and who drive fancy cars. Yes, I do drive fancy car, and I do fly private jet, but I work for it.

So what has life been like for you since the show premiered? Is business busier than ever right now?

It’s the same. I have a very, very successful operation. We got about 75 people on staff, and we very, very busy as a salon and spa. I didn’t see the growth [from the show yet]. Could people recognize me? Yes. I’ve been to couple places, and people say, “Oh, you’re on The Golden Bachelorette.” That’s good for the ego but doesn’t bring me anything.

Well, I appreciate the honesty and openness.

Thank you. My friends love me because they said, “You say it the way it is.” Sometimes I [need to be] filtered, but this is my personality. I thought for a reason, being in The Golden Bachelorette and have the exposure on TV will bring me something; to be honest with you, it doesn’t bring me anything. It’s not like somebody call me and said, “Hey, let’s endorse this. Let’s do that.” I can’t say that my business has been booming since I’ve been on the show because my business was booming before I was on the show.

But are you glad you did the show?

Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. I am grateful for the experience. I enjoy the time I spend with those guys, and I enjoy meeting Joan. I think the experience alone, being away from the cell phone, the social media, the internet, and the news and be stuck with 20 guys into a house give you the opportunity to really open up and get to know each other on a personal level. That was to me the most incredible thing of that experience. Besides meeting Joan and going through the process of selection. You know what I mean? It’s funny because I went on a date with her. We took the jet, we went to Vegas, we stayed in Paris Hotel, we had a fantastic time. We came back, she said goodbye, and the next day, she’s Jonathan’s girlfriend. So somebody said, “How do you feel?” I said, “I don’t feel so bad because I got the jet.” It’s true. I get the good jet, the good food, and he get the rose and the picnic basket.” [Laughs.]

This interviewed has been edited for clarity.

Originally Appeared on Glamour